Philosophy Now Forum

Blaggard wrote:The population growth scaremongers are just that, I know about the idea that we wont be able to feed a burgeoning population. If China used all modern technology, it's farming output could feed the world on its own. Whilst populations have grown steadily technologies that promote better crop fecundity have grown as well, the fact that there are people starving on Earth has nothing to do with food production, although that is a bit off topic so I won't digress.

Suffice to say I agree completely that the touted scare on population growth is just that, my only point was, we are ok for enough people, we don't need to procreate to ensure the survival of the species or to create more people. I also know that westernisation with the introduction of contraception into developing countries such as Pakistan, for example, has driven population growth down to a large extent: from the average number of children being over a dozen to four in fact. So I am aware of technological developments impetus to population numbers. It's guestimated that the human population will level out at some point, somewhere in the 20 billion region. I personal, have no doubt that by then food production and perhaps the lessening of dickhead politics and unfair trade, will have ameliorated food shortages more than now, but then it always has. We are making progress, with all the pace of a glacier but progress still.

My point was only to say I deny sex is about procreation, there have been several examples where it has been pointed out, it is clearly not about population growth that was just a suggestion for the need to promote life, which clearly we don't need to do. You should probably hence, tackle those things that challenge the idea that sex is about procreation, because the population growth thing is not relevant.

You see, Blaggard, I presented those sources to show you that overpopulation is a myth, which is why I said that it was by no means any big of a deal. The real big deal, which I have shown, are that there are falling birth rates, especially that within the western world and the Asian world as well. The real issues that are congruent with the falling fertility is because not only the advent of GMOs and other chemicals that are affecting people in many ways, but also because the idea that "sex is not procreation" and that it's all about "free sex", is what's causing there to be lower fertility, considering that sperm is being wasted for masturbation and other non-procreative sex. The latter is also in conjunction with the contraceptive movement, especially during the 1960s and today, where the message is "you can have sex all you want - just keep it 'safe' (as in by birth control and other contraceptives). Both of which are attacking the procreative aspects of sex, which is why I am making the case for sex being about procreation.

"when you say these things are unjustified, you mean biologically unjustified"

Yeah...thought I was clear on that...guess I wasn't.

#

"I wonder where the human urge (very powerful in some) to rebel stands in the biological analysis?"

Perhaps there's an 'ornery gene'

WanderingLands wrote:

Blaggard wrote:The population growth scaremongers are just that, I know about the idea that we wont be able to feed a burgeoning population. If China used all modern technology, it's farming output could feed the world on its own. Whilst populations have grown steadily technologies that promote better crop fecundity have grown as well, the fact that there are people starving on Earth has nothing to do with food production, although that is a bit off topic so I won't digress.

Suffice to say I agree completely that the touted scare on population growth is just that, my only point was, we are ok for enough people, we don't need to procreate to ensure the survival of the species or to create more people. I also know that westernisation with the introduction of contraception into developing countries such as Pakistan, for example, has driven population growth down to a large extent: from the average number of children being over a dozen to four in fact. So I am aware of technological developments impetus to population numbers. It's guestimated that the human population will level out at some point, somewhere in the 20 billion region. I personal, have no doubt that by then food production and perhaps the lessening of dickhead politics and unfair trade, will have ameliorated food shortages more than now, but then it always has. We are making progress, with all the pace of a glacier but progress still.

My point was only to say I deny sex is about procreation, there have been several examples where it has been pointed out, it is clearly not about population growth that was just a suggestion for the need to promote life, which clearly we don't need to do. You should probably hence, tackle those things that challenge the idea that sex is about procreation, because the population growth thing is not relevant.

You see, Blaggard, I presented those sources to show you that overpopulation is a myth, which is why I said that it was by no means any big of a deal. The real big deal, which I have shown, are that there are falling birth rates, especially that within the western world and the Asian world as well. The real issues that are congruent with the falling fertility is because not only the advent of GMOs and other chemicals that are affecting people in many ways, but also because the idea that "sex is not procreation" and that it's all about "free sex", is what's causing there to be lower fertility, considering that sperm is being wasted for masturbation and other non-procreative sex. The latter is also in conjunction with the contraceptive movement, especially during the 1960s and today, where the message is "you can have sex all you want - just keep it 'safe' (as in by birth control and other contraceptives). Both of which are attacking the procreative aspects of sex, which is why I am making the case for sex being about procreation.

Are you trying then to say that falling birth numbers mean populations in the West are in decline because that would also be a load of horse apples, they are stagnating, contraception tends to mean population levels tend to be if not growing stagnant, ie no of births balance out number of deaths, which frankly is the best news to the himan race in at least 100 years. To be honest I have no idea what your argument is any more, just that it is clearly unfounded.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:World ... 8UN%29.svg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_population

Graphs clearly show the trend is to either growth or euqilibrium, Asia is firmly in the growth category and clearly is going to be there for quite some time.

If procreation is about contraception why don't you tackle the points that were made where it clearly isn't. If you are using contraception it clearly isn't about procreation, it's clearly most of the time about pleasure. If your gay it certainly isnt.

I don't think I even remotely understand what you are getting at here., you seem to want to have your cake and eat it?

An ideological zombie wanders the lands, gnawing at everything in its path. A trail of incoherent and corrosive slobber testifies to each shambling step. Ideas stew in the belly of the beast, softening, blending one with another, never digested, but prone to reflux, random sprays of toxic goo. The zombie will doubtless be offended by what I've written. It prefers to think for itself, unaware that it has not yet learned to think. Those that encourage the zombie's trance do it no favors. I write out of love for what it could be.

the Hessian wrote:An ideological zombie wanders the lands, gnawing at everything in its path. A trail of incoherent and corrosive slobber testifies to each shambling step. Ideas stew in the belly of the beast, softening, blending one with another, never digested, but prone to reflux, random sprays of toxic goo. The zombie will doubtless be offended by what I've written. It prefers to think for itself, unaware that it has not yet learned to think. Those that encourage the zombie's trance do it no favors. I write out of love for what it could be.

Ok who is that directed at though, obviously not me because you have made it clear you don't agree with the argument sex is about procreation, but you should probably at least indicate who you mean or that's just random and pointless?

Just saying.

I enjoy your posts immensely. You speak because you have something to say.

The answer you are looking for is already there in the first six words.

If anything, sex is about physical resetting (I often masturbate to relieve myself of anxious elements in myself) and an intense moment of shaping your psycho-emotional infrastructure.

The later is why the setting of sex is often so important, whether it is to reinforce an idea of unity, of things being "special and unique", of domination and submission, of identity, or it might even be about such things as pride.

It's a very intense moment, and the moment is accompanied by a social setting which works to perpetuate some belief about the social relationship in general, which are the above-mentioned ideas.

People use these to feel good about themselves, as they reinforce ones willpower (the effectiveness of psychological infrastructures), by injecting into the damaged/malfunctioning infrastructure a sense of belief that collects essential resource and brings them onto another plane. A bit like setting up a second infrastructure beside the current infrastructure, and working and/or essential parts of the former to the later.

I wouldn't count masturbation as sex per se, maybe if it were mutual, I think sex is between two people, but I agree with everything you said.

Blaggard wrote:I wouldn't count masturbation as sex per se, maybe if it were mutual, I think sex is between two people, but I agree with everything you said.

^^ Masturbation is most definitely sex. Just because you have sex with yourself doesn't mean you don't have sex. Thinking is not actuality, it is the case whether you find it to be the case or not.

Hmm it's a moot point I think:

Sex

1.
(chiefly with reference to people) sexual activity, including specifically sexual intercourse.
"he enjoyed talking about sex"
synonyms: sexual intercourse, intercourse, lovemaking, making love, sex act, sexual relations, sexual/vaginal/anal penetration;

2.
either of the two main categories (male and female) into which humans and most other living things are divided on the basis of their reproductive functions.

verb
verb: sex; 3rd person present: sexes; past tense: sexed; past participle: sexed; gerund or present participle: sexing

Sexual intercourse, or coitus or copulation, is chiefly the insertion and thrusting of a male's penis, usually when erect, into a female's vagina for the purposes of sexual pleasure or reproduction; also known as vaginal intercourse or vaginal sex.[3][4][5][6] Other forms of penetrative sexual intercourse include penetration of the anus by the penis (anal sex), penetration of the mouth by the penis or oral penetration of the vulva or vagina (oral sex), sexual penetration by the fingers (fingering), and penetration by use of a strap-on dildo.[7][8][9] These activities involve physical intimacy between two or more individuals and are usually used among humans solely for physical or emotional pleasure and commonly contribute to human bonding.[7][10]

A variety of views concern what constitutes sexual intercourse or other sexual activity,[11][12] which can also impact views on sexual health.[13] Although the term sexual intercourse, particularly the variant coitus, most commonly denotes penile-vaginal penetration and the possibility of creating offspring (which is the fertilization process known as reproduction),[3][5][6][14] it also commonly denotes penetrative oral sex and particularly penile-anal sex.[7][8][15] Non-penetrative sex acts, such as non-penetrative forms of cunnilingus or mutual masturbation, have been termed outercourse,[16][17][18] but may additionally be among the sexual acts contributing to human bonding and considered sexual intercourse.[5][7] The term sex, often a shorthand for sexual intercourse, can mean any form of sexual activity.[19][20] Because people can be at risk of contracting sexually transmitted infections during these activities,[13][21] though the transmission risk is significantly reduced during non-penetrative sex,[18][22][23] safe sex practices are advised.[13]

sexual intercourse: wiki


I don't think sex is masturbation, but I don't think it really matters, so I won't belabour the point.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYXUUlQ5ofs

Exception is Mayor Adam Weeeeeest of course who married his left arm 1:16 in.

Blaggard wrote:Well I guess some people are still living in the ice age, I disagree it is.

Make your argument sex is about procreation, in what way it only about that, and for what reason you think it is about that please digress.

Persuant to rule 429/bii this has nothing to do with anything but adult sex, please do not make it into a subject that does not take that on board.

HQ has his head up his ass with respect to this topic. Look at him, a throwback to the stone age. He admits it himself, living in the woods shooting everything that moves, or that offends his sensibilities, a modern day cave man, Cro-Magnon. And in his time, the Upper Paleolithic, he'd be correct, sex was indeed only for procreation, as that version of man was few.

People like him have a problem with change. They live in a bygone era, because it's safe, change is scary for them. What they can't get their exceedingly prominent brow around, is that the world is finite, and that the biosphere is in fact symbiotic. This means that life on earth depends upon balance, ecosystems of circular nature, like we were taught in 7th grade science class. Did he attend? Did he pay attention? Did he pass? No I don't think so, spear and gun in hand, a throwback!

Evolution!! I see that as to sex, man is evolving, this is obvious with the ever continuing prominence of homosexuality and sex for fun, versus procreation. Today's science has meany means to ensure contraception, and rightfully so, man has tipped the scales seemingly in his favor, though only because his selfish needs are blinded to his writings, through actions, on the wall.

I've recently seen yet another documentary, produced by "Nova" in this case, on mankind's satellites, and what they've been able to tell us, about the "Earths Biosphere." As usual, these days, it ended talking about mankind's impact on the environment, that "most" scientists agree that we are killing off the systems, so fundamental to life on planet earth. So only ignorant, throwbacks, like maybe a Cro-Magnon, would think that today the human race requires procreation through sex.

Do I see a day where sexual reproduction is no longer a part of mans continuance? Yes, but only if he really wants to continue!

Blaggard wrote:sexual intercourse: wiki


I don't think sex is masturbation, but I don't think it really matters, so I won't belabour the point.

I wasn't talking about intercourse, I was talking about sex. Intercourse is two people, but sex doesn't have to be intercourse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sexu ... vity#Types

Blaggard wrote:

WanderingLands wrote:

Blaggard wrote:The population growth scaremongers are just that, I know about the idea that we wont be able to feed a burgeoning population. If China used all modern technology, it's farming output could feed the world on its own. Whilst populations have grown steadily technologies that promote better crop fecundity have grown as well, the fact that there are people starving on Earth has nothing to do with food production, although that is a bit off topic so I won't digress.

Suffice to say I agree completely that the touted scare on population growth is just that, my only point was, we are ok for enough people, we don't need to procreate to ensure the survival of the species or to create more people. I also know that westernisation with the introduction of contraception into developing countries such as Pakistan, for example, has driven population growth down to a large extent: from the average number of children being over a dozen to four in fact. So I am aware of technological developments impetus to population numbers. It's guestimated that the human population will level out at some point, somewhere in the 20 billion region. I personal, have no doubt that by then food production and perhaps the lessening of dickhead politics and unfair trade, will have ameliorated food shortages more than now, but then it always has. We are making progress, with all the pace of a glacier but progress still.

My point was only to say I deny sex is about procreation, there have been several examples where it has been pointed out, it is clearly not about population growth that was just a suggestion for the need to promote life, which clearly we don't need to do. You should probably hence, tackle those things that challenge the idea that sex is about procreation, because the population growth thing is not relevant.

You see, Blaggard, I presented those sources to show you that overpopulation is a myth, which is why I said that it was by no means any big of a deal. The real big deal, which I have shown, are that there are falling birth rates, especially that within the western world and the Asian world as well. The real issues that are congruent with the falling fertility is because not only the advent of GMOs and other chemicals that are affecting people in many ways, but also because the idea that "sex is not procreation" and that it's all about "free sex", is what's causing there to be lower fertility, considering that sperm is being wasted for masturbation and other non-procreative sex. The latter is also in conjunction with the contraceptive movement, especially during the 1960s and today, where the message is "you can have sex all you want - just keep it 'safe' (as in by birth control and other contraceptives). Both of which are attacking the procreative aspects of sex, which is why I am making the case for sex being about procreation.

Are you trying then to say that falling birth numbers mean populations in the West are in decline because that would also be a load of horse apples, they are stagnating, contraception tends to mean population levels tend to be if not growing stagnant, ie no of births balance out number of deaths, which frankly is the best news to the himan race in at least 100 years. To be honest I have no idea what your argument is any more, just that it is clearly unfounded.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:World ... 8UN%29.svg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_population

Graphs clearly show the trend is to either growth or euqilibrium, Asia is firmly in the growth category and clearly is going to be there for quite some time.

If procreation is about contraception why don't you tackle the points that were made where it clearly isn't. If you are using contraception it clearly isn't about procreation, it's clearly most of the time about pleasure. If your gay it certainly isnt.

I don't think I even remotely understand what you are getting at here., you seem to want to have your cake and eat it?

He's right about the GMO's, Fluoride, herbicides, insecticides and other chemicals in the US's food supply, air, water, etc. But that's just a testament to those steering the ship that are either capitalists only caring about money, or a more sinister scheme to control the budget by eliminating numbers of people. But as to the world population, he couldn't be more wrong.

I don't know where these freaks come from, probably from the side people like you and I are fighting, us pro mankind's continuance, and theirs it's demise. Or maybe just foolishness, just another capital venture in their eyes, blinded by a glittering prize. I'm not saying the earth couldn't necessarily support a larger population, just not now, in the way we do things dirty, ignoring the warning signs. As more population now, just means more people doing things dirty, the wrong way! Balance is the key! If we don't do so soon, we shall pass the point of no return. Some scientist think we already have.

Selfishness, contained in the promise of having advantage, mans current ignorance ensuring his downfall, lest he looks at himself in the mirror, really, really hard, and not afraid of change, that might be a little tough at first.

The Voice of Time wrote:

Blaggard wrote:sexual intercourse: wiki


I don't think sex is masturbation, but I don't think it really matters, so I won't belabour the point.

I wasn't talking about intercourse, I was talking about sex. Intercourse is two people, but sex doesn't have to be intercourse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sexu ... vity#Types

I don't get what you mean, sexual inercourse by definition is between two people. It wouldn't be intercourse by definition if it was about the ham shandy.

intercourse
ˈɪntəkɔːs/

communication or dealings between individuals or groups.
"everyday social intercourse"
synonyms: dealings, relations, relationships, association, connections, contact, interchange, communication, intercommunication, communion, correspondence, negotiations, bargaining, transactions, proceedings; More
trade, trading, business, commerce, traffic, trafficking;
informaltruck, doings
"the market was an important focus of social intercourse"

2.
short for sexual intercourse.
synonyms: sexual intercourse, sex, lovemaking, making love, sex act, act of love, sexual relations, intimate relations, intimacy, coupling, mating, going to bed with someone, sleeping with someone.

Consider sex as per definition as above as a shorthand for sexual intercourse in the same way intercourse is used for sexual intecourse, if you are talking about something else, you are speaking a different language to me, and I sincerely don't understand what you are getting at?

Sex and Sexual activity are not the same thing either, sexual activity involves anything to do with the genitals, sex as I defined it above is more reciprocal.

I don't consider masturbation the same as sex, or sexual intercourse is what I meant and indeed said, and it's what this thread is about so if you have strayed into some other act, like putting an orange in your mouth, tying a scarf around your neck and auto erotically asphyxiating yourself you are off topic. I think we could agree clealry ononism is not about procreation but that would be a whole other thread.