Alexiev wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:39 am
Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:03 am
Alexiev wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 12:14 am
You appear incapable of understanding much of anything.
I'm asking. You don't seem to be telling me anything different from that.
Patriarchy: a system of society or government in which men hold the power and women are largely excluded from it:
Yeah, I know the alleged "definition." Unreal words have definitions, too...like "unicorn."
It is possible to value children, or women, and to provide them with certain advantages yet remain patriarchal.
And? Is that good, or bad? Why?
Words have actual meanings.
You mean like the word "woman"? Yes, I agree. Since we're on that subject, why don't you define that one for me, but without using the word "woman." Give me a non-circular definition of what a "woman" is.
You may not like it ...
Utterly irrelevant to the question of the truth of the claim. The fact that I find "patriarchy" a dumb word has to do with the fact that it's unrealistic, not to how I feel about it.
Women have certain privileges.
You say "words have actual meanings." Let's see what "privilege" means.
Cambridge says,
"...an advantage that only one person or group of people has, usually because of their position or because they are rich." That's not perfect, but it will do. We can certainly say that a "privilege," by definition, is an extra benefit, not an entitlement. So why do women deserve "privilege," but men are to be considered evil for having "privilege"?
You'll have to explain that feature of the Feminist narrative to me. It looks unjust.
In contrast, I would argue that both sexes have certain rights and responsibilities, and they're not the same ones.
Perhaps you consider men to be evil for having privileges, but I don't and neither does anyone else (as far as I can tell).
So you don't believe in the "patriarchy" narrative? Good.
It is not evil to have privileges, unless those privileges deprive other people. "Women and children first" clearly deprives other people, and some people consider it evil both for infantilizing women, and for conferring unfair privileges. However, "women and children first" is a rule established through the chivalry of men. If it is evil, it is not the women who have unfairly conferred privileges on themselves; instead it is men who desire to be chivalrous and noble.
Oh. So the men who lay down their lives for women and children are "infantalizing" and "conferring unfair privileges" on women, which "deprive other people"?
Well, you certainly know how to make the heroes the villains.
Did you ever hear of male primogeniture?
Yes. It was the feudal system that kept estates from being split up by each generation. And it discriminated against all male children except one, as well as any female children, except the firstborn.
Isn't the fact that women couldn't vote in liberal democracies until 100 years ago indicative of patriarchy?
Is the fact that women can never be drafted a sign of matriarchy?
IN some countries, we elect nauseating Presidents (all of whom, in my country, have been men).
Well, now, we agree about that. The current crop of "leaders" is certainly a rotten bunch. But it's primarily women who have voted them in, we must note.
The idea that "unicorn" is an "unreal word" is idiotic (like most of what you write).
What I actually wrote was:
Unreal words have definitions, too...like "unicorn."
...which means that like "patriarchy," "unicorn" is a REAL word, in that it is a word -- but refers to a
fictional concept. How could I mean anything else? For if I use the word at all, it makes it really a word, really an utterance; but it does not mean that
the idea the word expresses is real.
