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Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Thu May 05, 2022 7:52 pm
by Sculptor
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 3:05 am
No humans would like to be killed is a fundamental biological and psychological fact that is supported by empirical evidences. This is universal and thus a fact.
You can't even get THAT right.
Many humans sacrifice their lives.
Many others commit suicide.
And other wish to be executed
e.g.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Gilmore
Then there is voluntary self euthanasia, and those that practice it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dignitas_ ... anisation)
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 6:04 am
by Veritas Aequitas
bahman wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 7:42 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 3:05 am
bahman wrote: ↑Wed May 04, 2022 1:08 pm
Like or dislike is not opinion.
Strawman!
Note I stated "personal" framework.
Like or dislike within a personal framework is an opinion.
Like or dislike within a universal framework can be a fact but this must be verified with empirical evidence and philosophical reasoning.
No humans would like to be killed is a fundamental biological and psychological fact that is supported by empirical evidences. This is universal and thus a fact.
There may be people with suicidal tendencies and 'like' to commit suicide, but they are the abnormal ones due to neural defects.
Opinion: a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge
What is your point or opinion?
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 2:37 pm
by henry quirk
The light that comes from the apple is gone.
But the
information it carried isn't.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 4:51 pm
by bahman
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 6:04 am
bahman wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 7:42 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 3:05 am
Strawman!
Note I stated "personal" framework.
Like or dislike within a personal framework is an opinion.
Like or dislike within a universal framework can be a fact but this must be verified with empirical evidence and philosophical reasoning.
No humans would like to be killed is a fundamental biological and psychological fact that is supported by empirical evidences. This is universal and thus a fact.
There may be people with suicidal tendencies and 'like' to commit suicide, but they are the abnormal ones due to neural defects.
Opinion: a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge
What is your point or opinion?
Likes and dislikes are not opinions in my dictionary. They are facts.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 4:54 pm
by bahman
henry quirk wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 2:37 pm
The light that comes from the apple is gone.
But the
information it carried isn't.
Yes, but my point is that the light that you call red is gone. It turns into other complicated things which are not red, like an electrical current.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 7:03 pm
by henry quirk
bahman wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 4:54 pm
henry quirk wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 2:37 pm
The light that comes from the apple is gone.
But the
information it carried isn't.
Yes, but my point is that the light that you call red is gone. It turns into other complicated things which are not red, like an electrical current.
You're fixated on the light; I focus on the
information and the
apprehension....not sure how to bridge the gap.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 10:52 pm
by bahman
henry quirk wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 7:03 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 4:54 pm
henry quirk wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 2:37 pm
But the
information it carried isn't.
Yes, but my point is that the light that you call red is gone. It turns into other complicated things which are not red, like an electrical current.
You're fixated on the light; I focus on the
information and the
apprehension....not sure how to bridge the gap.
Yes, it is information that reaches your mind enabling you to see. My point is the apple is not red since the red light as you called is gone when it hit the retina.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:59 am
by Veritas Aequitas
bahman wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 4:51 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 6:04 am
bahman wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 7:42 pm
Opinion: a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge
What is your point or opinion?
Likes and dislikes are not opinions in my dictionary. They are facts.
What??
That some one like or dislike something X is a fact if there are evidences of their expressing it, but the basis of their likes or dislikes are subjective to oneself, thus opinion or at best personal conviction.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 2:54 pm
by henry quirk
My point is the apple is not red since the red light as you called is gone when it hit the retina.
And my point is: the information (redness) is apprehended by me. Lights is a conductor of that information that I capture. The light stops, sure, but not before I've taken the
information from it.
So, yeah, the apple is red.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 6:01 pm
by bahman
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 4:59 am
bahman wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 4:51 pm
Likes and dislikes are not opinions in my dictionary. They are facts.
What??
That some one like or dislike something X is a fact if there are evidences of their expressing it, but the basis of their likes or dislikes are subjective to oneself, thus opinion or at best personal conviction.
It is a fact.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 6:02 pm
by bahman
henry quirk wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 2:54 pm
My point is the apple is not red since the red light as you called is gone when it hit the retina.
And my point is: the information (redness) is apprehended by me. Lights is a conductor of that information that I capture. The light stops, sure, but not before I've taken the
information from it.
So, yeah, the apple is red.
It seems red.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 6:03 pm
by henry quirk
bahman wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:02 pm
henry quirk wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 2:54 pm
My point is the apple is not red since the red light as you called is gone when it hit the retina.
And my point is: the information (redness) is apprehended by me. Lights is a conductor of that information that I capture. The light stops, sure, but not before I've taken the
information from it.
So, yeah, the apple is red.
It seems red.
cuz it is
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 6:15 pm
by bahman
henry quirk wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:03 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:02 pm
henry quirk wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 2:54 pm
And my point is: the information (redness) is apprehended by me. Lights is a conductor of that information that I capture. The light stops, sure, but not before I've taken the
information from it.
So, yeah, the apple is red.
It seems red.
cuz it is
It is not.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 1:11 am
by henry quirk
bahman wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:15 pm
henry quirk wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:03 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:02 pm
It seems red.
cuz it is
It is not.
Is so.
Re: Moral realism is true
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 4:34 am
by Veritas Aequitas
bahman wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 6:01 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 4:59 am
bahman wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 4:51 pm
Likes and dislikes are not opinions in my dictionary. They are facts.
What??
That some one like or dislike something X is a fact if there are evidences of their expressing it, but the basis of their likes or dislikes are subjective to oneself, thus opinion or at best personal conviction.
It is a fact.
Such one liner is nonsensical which reflect badly on your intellectual competence and integrity.
Are you capable of more rational counters?