Philosophy Now Forum

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 12:18 am

Advocate wrote: ↑Thu Oct 15, 2020 8:57 pm More harm has been done in the name of religion than any other cause but profit. And to say that most of it was not good or legitimate religion is another mark against it for being so easily corruptible.

Jesus was a socialist.
How is it that in the USA it seems to be the right-wing who are the most obsessively Christian.
How can it be that Trump ordered the police to crush a peacefull BLM rally in DC, so that he could wave a Bible for a photoshoot after dragging citizens off the patio of the church in chains?

There are socio-historical causes of that American religiosity, But I forget just what they are. I think it it is to do with how people in the mid -west feel inferior to the more educated more affluent eastern areas.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:32 am

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 12:18 am

Advocate wrote: ↑Thu Oct 15, 2020 8:57 pm More harm has been done in the name of religion than any other cause but profit. And to say that most of it was not good or legitimate religion is another mark against it for being so easily corruptible.

Jesus was a socialist.
How is it that in the USA it seems to be the right-wing who are the most obsessively Christian.
How can it be that Trump ordered the police to crush a peacefull BLM rally in DC, so that he could wave a Bible for a photoshoot after dragging citizens off the patio of the church in chains?

There are socio-historical causes of that American religiosity, But I forget just what they are. I think it it is to do with how people in the mid -west feel inferior to the more educated more affluent eastern areas.

Maybe a people who commit genocide in the face of God, and seem to have been rewarded for it are most likley to end up thinking they are god's chosen?
Since the whites have managed to dominate an entire continent with impugnity it is no wonder they suffer from a superiority complex.
Much the same still persists in the British aristocracy. But having surrendered the empire doubt remain.

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:42 am

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:32 am

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 12:18 am

Jesus was a socialist.
How is it that in the USA it seems to be the right-wing who are the most obsessively Christian.
How can it be that Trump ordered the police to crush a peacefull BLM rally in DC, so that he could wave a Bible for a photoshoot after dragging citizens off the patio of the church in chains?

There are socio-historical causes of that American religiosity, But I forget just what they are. I think it it is to do with how people in the mid -west feel inferior to the more educated more affluent eastern areas.

Maybe a people who commit genocide in the face of God, and seem to have been rewarded for it are most likley to end up thinking they are god's chosen?
Since the whites have managed to dominate an entire continent with impugnity it is no wonder they suffer from a superiority complex.
Much the same still persists in the British aristocracy. But having surrendered the empire doubt remain.

That won't do, Sculptor because people who remained in the American eastern seaboard states were as guilty of genocide as anyone else. The cause of American religiosity is simpler than that . The cause is envy of a more affluent geographical and cultural group in a nation that is supposed to be equal. People use religion to console and legitimate feelings.Trump was using this fact when he did his funny photo shoot with the bible book.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:49 am ...people who remained in the American eastern seaboard states were as guilty of genocide as anyone else....

What "genocide" did the people on the Eastern Seaboard allegedly commit?

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 4:01 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:49 am ...people who remained in the American eastern seaboard states were as guilty of genocide as anyone else....

What "genocide" did the people on the Eastern Seaboard allegedly commit?

Traditional hunting territories were appropriated by settlers and so the indigenous people's way of lif was destroyed. Genocide is destruction of a society.

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 12:18 am

Advocate wrote: ↑Thu Oct 15, 2020 8:57 pm More harm has been done in the name of religion than any other cause but profit. And to say that most of it was not good or legitimate religion is another mark against it for being so easily corruptible.

Jesus was a socialist.
How is it that in the USA it seems to be the right-wing who are the most obsessively Christian.
How can it be that Trump ordered the police to crush a peacefull BLM rally in DC, so that he could wave a Bible for a photoshoot after dragging citizens off the patio of the church in chains?

Would a socialist use genocide as justice?

Lest we forget, Jesus is to use Armageddon and genocide when he returns.

Regards
DL

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 10:14 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 4:01 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:49 am ...people who remained in the American eastern seaboard states were as guilty of genocide as anyone else....

What "genocide" did the people on the Eastern Seaboard allegedly commit?

Traditional hunting territories were appropriated by settlers and so the indigenous people's way of lif was destroyed. Genocide is destruction of a society.

No, "genocide" is the deliberate destruction of an entire genetic line.

The European settlers had no thought of genocide. They were just looking for a place to live, farm and develop opportunities, and were more competitive and had much better technologies than the locals did. But they knew no bacteriology or virology; and for most of the aboriginals, it was disease, not aggression or some campaign of liquidation, that killed them.

So that's tommyrot. It's not how the thing happened at all.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:02 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 10:14 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 4:01 pm
What "genocide" did the people on the Eastern Seaboard allegedly commit?

Traditional hunting territories were appropriated by settlers and so the indigenous people's way of lif was destroyed. Genocide is destruction of a society.

No, "genocide" is the deliberate destruction of an entire genetic line.

The European settlers had no thought of genocide. They were just looking for a place to live, farm and develop opportunities, and were more competitive and had much better technologies than the locals did. But they knew no bacteriology or virology; and for most of the aboriginals, it was disease, not aggression or some campaign of liquidation, that killed them.

So that's tommyrot. It's not how the thing happened at all.

You describe the first stage of aggressive genocide. Certainly the settlers knew they were taking the hunting lands. Note this is the same sort of behaviour on the part of Israelis destroying Palestinians' houses. Same as Myanmar army destroying Rohingya villages.

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:22 pm You describe the first stage of aggressive genocide.

Hogwash.

Go ask a Jew or an Armenian what a real "genocide" is. You throwing around the term like that is just what they love to hear.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:28 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:22 pm You describe the first stage of aggressive genocide.

Hogwash.

Go ask a Jew or an Armenian what a real "genocide" is. You throwing around the term like that is just what they love to hear.

Your idea is simplistic. Genocide is a process that in all cases of genocide begins with social psychology and historical attitudes.

Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:22 am

Go ask a Jew or an Armenian what a real "genocide" is. You throwing around the term like that is just what they love to hear.

Your idea is simplistic.

No. Just accurate.

You do people no favours when you sling hyperbole around like that. You obscure the truth about those you accuse, and minimize the evil of those who actually participated in genocide. You do a disservice to every victim.

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=478776 time=1604670461 user_id=9431]
[quote=Belinda post_id=478770 time=1604654578 user_id=12709][quote]
Go ask a Jew or an Armenian what a real "genocide" is. You throwing around the term like that is just what they love to hear.
[/quote] Your idea is simplistic.[/quote]
No. Just accurate.

You do people no favours when you sling hyperbole around like that. You obscure the truth about those you accuse, and minimize the evil of those who actually participated in genocide. You do a disservice to every victim.
[/quote]

She said first stage and you substituted the entire package. Leave her alone.

Advocate wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 3:19 pm She said first stage and you substituted the entire package. Leave her alone.

Heh. "White knighting," eh?

Nobody's being hurt here, chum. We're debating whether it's okay to trivialize genocide by using it to describe anything one vaguely doesn't like. I'm suggesting not.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 3:52 pm

Advocate wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 3:19 pm She said first stage and you substituted the entire package. Leave her alone.

Heh. "White knighting," eh?

Nobody's being hurt here, chum. We're debating whether it's okay to trivialize genocide by using it to describe anything one vaguely doesn't like. I'm suggesting not.

Nobody here trivialises genocide, Mannie. However it's wise to see the earlier signs of genocide and try to take steps to alter attitudes to ethnic minorities . That would be to learn a lesson from history.

Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:21 pm However it's wise to see the earlier signs of genocide and try to take steps to alter attitudes to ethnic minorities . That would be to learn a lesson from history.

Except that there WAS no "genocide" in the case of the American eastern seaboard. What happened was only what always happened whenever a stronger, more developed civilization ran into a less-developed one. The less-developed one lost.

So I suggest we reserve the word "genocide" for referring to something that actually stands a chance of being appropriately labeled thereby. To do otherwise is to trivialize real genocides.