Philosophy Now Forum

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 5:59 am Biological consciousness is the only source of meaning in the world; it is the measure and meaning of all things. There is nothing in the world that has meaning in and of itself, but only as it relates to biological consciousness. That said, the only way for morality, which is a meaning, thus is the property of consciousness to become objective, is through subjective projection into the world. Morality is the subjective sentiments of humans, in this case, as extensions of human nature and self-interest, which can be found objectively in the forms of systems, establishments, codes of conduct, and societal norms. All meanings in the world are subjective projections onto a meaningless world. There is only meaning for life forms.

Yes, sure. However the question I ask is which meaning do Popeye , Belinda, and all impose upon the meaningless.

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 5:59 am Biological consciousness is the only source of meaning in the world; it is the measure and meaning of all things. There is nothing in the world that has meaning in and of itself, but only as it relates to biological consciousness.

Defend "a program depends upon the hardware on which it runs". Explains why it is possible to construct PROOFS about what a program can or cannot do even though the machine (the hardware) is imaginary and does not actually exist.

In other words, explain WHY just because the "hardware" that is implementing the neural net that is our brain makes whatever function that neural net evaluates a BIOLOGICAL thing.

MikeNovack wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 4:22 pm

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 5:59 am Biological consciousness is the only source of meaning in the world; it is the measure and meaning of all things. There is nothing in the world that has meaning in and of itself, but only as it relates to biological consciousness.

Defend "a program depends upon the hardware on which it runs". Explains why it is possible to construct PROOFS about what a program can or cannot do even though the machine (the hardware) is imaginary and does not actually exist.

In other words, explain WHY just because the "hardware" that is implementing the neural net that is our brain makes whatever function that neural net evaluates a BIOLOGICAL thing.

Come on Popeye, explain to Mike that brain and mind are two aspects( objective and subjective) of the same .

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 11:12 am

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 5:59 am Biological consciousness is the only source of meaning in the world; it is the measure and meaning of all things. There is nothing in the world that has meaning in and of itself, but only as it relates to biological consciousness. That said, the only way for morality, which is a meaning, thus is the property of consciousness to become objective, is through subjective projection into the world. Morality is the subjective sentiments of humans, in this case, as extensions of human nature and self-interest, which can be found objectively in the forms of systems, establishments, codes of conduct, and societal norms. All meanings in the world are subjective projections onto a meaningless world. There is only meaning for life forms.

Yes, sure. However, the question I ask is which meaning do Popeye, Belinda, and all impose upon the meaningless.

To be sure, there will be variations, but not so striking as we all have basically the same sensory apparatus, though not the same quality of understanding. Our common biology is Greenwich time. It would involve more continuity, more harmony than is presently available to us. As we think of democracy, where the majority rules, it should balance out as the order of species creates its most desirable outcome.

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 10:49 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 11:12 am

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 5:59 am Biological consciousness is the only source of meaning in the world; it is the measure and meaning of all things. There is nothing in the world that has meaning in and of itself, but only as it relates to biological consciousness. That said, the only way for morality, which is a meaning, thus is the property of consciousness to become objective, is through subjective projection into the world. Morality is the subjective sentiments of humans, in this case, as extensions of human nature and self-interest, which can be found objectively in the forms of systems, establishments, codes of conduct, and societal norms. All meanings in the world are subjective projections onto a meaningless world. There is only meaning for life forms.

Yes, sure. However, the question I ask is which meaning do Popeye, Belinda, and all impose upon the meaningless.

To be sure, there will be variations, but not so striking as we all have basically the same sensory apparatus, though not the same quality of understanding. Our common biology is Greenwich time. It would involve more continuity, more harmony than is presently available to us. As we think of democracy, where the majority rules, it should balance out as the order of species creates its most desirable outcome.

Ah Popeye you are a Romantic. "Shades of the prisonhouse begin to close upon the growing boy."

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 8:54 pm

MikeNovack wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 4:22 pm

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 5:59 am Biological consciousness is the only source of meaning in the world; it is the measure and meaning of all things. There is nothing in the world that has meaning in and of itself, but only as it relates to biological consciousness.

Defend "a program depends upon the hardware on which it runs". Explains why it is possible to construct PROOFS about what a program can or cannot do even though the machine (the hardware) is imaginary and does not actually exist.
In other words, explain WHY just because the "hardware" that is implementing the neural net that is our brain makes whatever function that neural net evaluates a BIOLOGICAL thing.

Come on Popeye, explain to Mike that brain and mind are two aspects( objective and subjective) of the same .

Well, we do agree, I hope, that the hardware is the body/brain of a subjective organism. The program is the objective fuel of the physical world as it affects/changes the physical state of the subjective organism; this is biological experience, and the understanding of that experience is meaning. This is the relationship of subject and object, which either stands or falls together, meaning both are essential to the biological readout of an apparent reality. You are presuming the mind does not exist, or the entire subjective organism does not exist. I'll assume mind. The mind is what knows the body as its first idea, and is the one thing you should be most sure of as a living energy form, with a world of other energy forms informing you of their existences. Our understanding is, of course, limited about the nature of energy and its possibilities. I am reminded of a question asked of Bertrand Russell, "What is electricity?" He answers, Electricity is the way in which things behave, which covers all of reality.

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 11:17 pm

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 10:49 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 11:12 am
Yes, sure. However, the question I ask is which meaning do Popeye, Belinda, and all impose upon the meaningless.

To be sure, there will be variations, but not so striking as we all have basically the same sensory apparatus, though not the same quality of understanding. Our common biology is Greenwich time. It would involve more continuity, more harmony than is presently available to us. As we think of democracy, where the majority rules, it should balance out as the order of species creates its most desirable outcome.

Ah Popeye you are a Romantic. "Shades of the prisonhouse begin to close upon the growing boy."

Hi Belinda,
LOL!! Never thought of myself as a romantic.