A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists

[Dubious]

Ahh, No True Scotsman, I've been labeled as a theist so I must believe what you think I believe, I can't possibly accept evolution because I'm a theist, and you are stupid.

...that may be true on occasion but I always preferred the lesser evil. As a non-theist, I try to acknowledge limits which theists clearly don't subscribe to.

According to you, what do I have to believe?

...nothing that I say or qualified to say on behalf of another. As an older person, believe what your conscience commends as a source of comfort. There’s no payback now in getting analytical. Most of the objections here have less to do with belief in the Bible than with IC’s sick virulence against atheists which in its insane hatred completely escapes reality.

If you agree with the following, as you seem to, then your belief has degraded you into lunacy equal to his own which has nothing of god or the godlike in it. What you believe, I think, should predispose more to thinking about God than damning atheists by every subterfuge known as if it were a means of salvation for the theist.

Immanuel Can wrote:3. Atheism allows people to be good if they already want to; but it also allows them to be totally evil if they want to. There is no evil it forbids, or upon which it even frowns. There is no good it favours, and no virtue it teaches us to reward. It has no position on moral values at all...except that no ultimate grounds for them exist.

The entire statement reeks with hatred and everything a Medieval fanatic would assert. There is NO GOD here and NO CATEGORICAL IMPERATIVE in operation...but you find nothing wrong with it!

Also, if atheism allows people to be “totally evil” then what is theism’s excuse in generating and justifying some of the most atrocious events in history all in the “Name of God” to boot? Atheism never managed to be that absolute in any period!

[thedoc]

Incredible that they actually believe it's a good look. I imagine doc's wife as a wind-tunneler, with a kristian bee-hive 'do and huge teeth.

Attacking me is one thing, I really don't care, but attacking my family, when they are not here to defend themselves is really despicable, and beyond uncivil.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

Incredible that they actually believe it's a good look. I imagine doc's wife as a wind-tunneler, with a kristian bee-hive 'do and huge teeth.

Attacking me is one thing, I really don't care, but attacking my family, when they are not here to defend themselves is really despicable, and beyond uncivil.

Ok. Apologise to your wife for me for saying I imagined her in a wind tunnel. And Americans always seem to have huge teeth, so that's not much of a stretch.

[thedoc]

According to you, what do I have to believe?

...nothing that I say or qualified to say on behalf of another. As an older person, believe what your conscience commends as a source of comfort. There’s no payback now in getting analytical. Most of the objections here have less to do with belief in the Bible than with IC’s sick virulence against atheists which in its insane hatred completely escapes reality.

Nice dodge, Again what do I believe according to you? I was asking what you think that I am supposed to believe. Without your being specific, I can't respond with an agreement or denial.

What IC believes or doesn't believe is irrelevant to the conversation. We tend to agree but there are some minor differences.

[thedoc]

And Americans always seem to have huge teeth, so that's not much of a stretch.

Perhaps because Americans are always happy and smiling, their teeth are more noticeable than someone who is not smiling because they are not in America.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

And Americans always seem to have huge teeth, so that's not much of a stretch.

Perhaps because Americans are always happy and smiling, their teeth are more noticeable than someone who is not smiling because they are not in America.

I've never heard of smiling making your teeth bigger. You learn something every day.

[Arising_uk]

"No true Scotsman". Just shows how much you don't know, and haven't been paying attention.

There's loads I don't know about theists I'd say, just like theists(at least on this forum) appear to have little idea about atheists, so if you don't mind enlighten me and answer the sentences with questions marks, or are you just another interweeb loon with an aversion to questions.

[thedoc]

Really? You are a Christian who does not believe in an end of times when 'God' and Jesus return to judge us all and have a big battle with the unbelievers to establish 'heaven' upon the earth.

All theist religions have such a scenario I thought?

Since I haven't died (yet) I'll give it a try, I believe the "end of times" is an individual thing and not necessarily an event that will happen world wide at one time. Each individual faces their own judgment on death, and for believers, as determined by God not men, that will determine heaven or not. Heaven does not involve endless time, but eternity, which is different.

I really can't speak for what other Christians believe, unlike some atheists who think they know what all Christians and other religious people are supposed to believe.

[Immanuel Can]

Mr. snooty pants Can evidently doesn't know anything about VT. If he did he would know that he is a she.

The gender of any cyber-presence isn't a very interesting question, ordinarily. And should it be relevant to philosophy? It's difficult to see why. But okay, if you say so.

[thedoc]

And Americans always seem to have huge teeth, so that's not much of a stretch.

Perhaps because Americans are always happy and smiling, their teeth are more noticeable than someone who is not smiling because they are not in America.

I've never heard of smiling making your teeth bigger. You learn something every day.

I didn't say "bigger" I said "more noticeable", there is a difference.

[Immanuel Can]

There are a lot of kristian charities because kristians are the biggest thieves and scammers, and they exploit kristian guilt and desire for brown-points.
Money that's hidden in foreign bank accounts isn't going to show up, idiot. The Salvation Army is a multi-billion dollar corporation. A few soup kitchens and 'charity' shops (that incidentally make a hell of a lot of money) aren't going to make a dent in the interest, let alone net profit.

I can understand your spite and venom. After all, they're certainly outperforming the billions of Atheist-run soup kitchens. Competition is so cruel.

What can you say for someone who finds a way to begrudge the poor a bowl of soup?

Maybe, "Have a nice day." Not much else.

[thedoc]

Mr. snooty pants Can evidently doesn't know anything about VT. If he did he would know that he is a she.

The gender of any cyber-presence isn't a very interesting question, ordinarily. And should it be relevant to philosophy? It's difficult to see why. But okay, if you say so.

Apparently Harbal thinks that only men can do philosophy and women are too emotional.

[Immanuel Can]

Oxfam, Doctors Without Borders/Médecins Sans Frontières, The Red Cross, UNICEF, are good examples no?

No.

Red Cross -- "Founder: J. H. Dunant was born in Geneva, Switzerland, the first son of businessman Jean-Jacques Dunant and Antoinette Dunant-Colladon. His family was devoutly Calvinist..."

UNICEF -- "Faith-based organizations and religious groups have become important partners in UNICEF's work with children across the globe. In developing countries, UNICEF works very closely with religious communities - ranging from those of the Buddhist and Islamic faith to several denominations within the Christian faith - whose tenets of religion include an interest in the health and wellbeing of people, and particularly of children..."

Oxfam -- "Oxfam was founded at 17 Broad Street in Oxford, Oxfordshire, in 1942 as the Oxford Committee for Famine Relief by a group of Quakers, social activists, and Oxford academics..."

Seriously.

[Immanuel Can]

Apparently Harbal thinks that only men can do philosophy and women are too emotional.

Yes. Or as you suggested, he has some personal reason for caring whether or not they are...

[thedoc]

There are a lot of kristian charities because kristians are the biggest thieves and scammers, and they exploit kristian guilt and desire for brown-points.
Money that's hidden in foreign bank accounts isn't going to show up, idiot. The Salvation Army is a multi-billion dollar corporation. A few soup kitchens and 'charity' shops (that incidentally make a hell of a lot of money) aren't going to make a dent in the interest, let alone net profit.

I can understand your spite and venom. After all, they're certainly outperforming the billions of Atheist-run soup kitchens. Competition is so cruel.

What can you say for someone who finds a way to begrudge the poor a bowl of soup?

Maybe, "Have a nice day." Not much else.

All the organizations around here that provide for for those in need are religious based organizations, perhaps the atheists feel that the religious based groups are doing such a good job that they don't need to do anything. That does not just include food, it also provides other services, clothing, school supplies, payments for utilities, etc.