Pistolero wrote: ↑Fri Apr 18, 2025 12:42 pm
Didn't Nietzsche adequately diagnose the Christian disease?
Everything that followed is a footnote to his polemics.
Broaden his diagnosis to include all three Abrahamic variants of the same dis-ease.... then realize how it has evolved into secular variants, like Marxism and postmodernism
Indeed....
For those with a weak constitution the cure can be deadly. They need lies.
Getting over one lie they need another to help therm endure.
Scapegoating is addictive.
Many need something, if not someone, to blame for everything bad that happens to them.
If not God, then Satan, and if not Satan....the cosmos.....
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 11:19 am
Indeed....
For those with a weak constitution the cure can be deadly. They need lies.
Getting over one lie they need another to help therm endure.
Scapegoating is addictive.
Many need something, if not someone, to blame for everything bad that happens to them.
If not God, then Satan, and if not Satan....the cosmos.....
Well, friend (you seem to have necessarily reinvented yourself? ; ) I've seen the history. Our relationship starts here). I'm a mixture of pathetically weak and robust. I needed certainties. Nobody knowingly lied to me. But untruths they certainly were. And I made them more and more palatable. I wanted no scapegoat at all. Which, after I deconstructed an untruth too far (the Pericope Adulterae), I was left with the cold, piercing, harsh, beautiful light of reason. The ultimate false scapegoat being Jesus: if Love were the ground of being, They didn't necessitate him. The evolving God of the Bible is not Love. And nature doesn't necessitate Love. So we must do the best we can. Like Ricky Gervais in Afterlife.
What necessitates 'love' is survival.....nature had to overcome the fight/flight defensive mechanism to allow cooperative survival strategies to emerge.
It has now become an ontology, using the usual linguistic tricks.
We are all synthesis of weak/strong traits.
We all need a scapegoat.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 12:37 pm
[1] What necessitates 'love' is survival.....nature had to overcome the fight/flight defensive mechanism to allow cooperative survival strategies to emerge.
[2] It has now become an ontology, using the usual linguistic tricks.
[3] We are all synthesis of weak/strong traits.
[4] We all need a scapegoat.
[If I may]
[1] Agreed.
[2] It's become an entity in itself? A thing? It's got emergent characteristics. Our group sense spirals out to the whole species and beyond.
[3] I have strong weaknesses and weak strengths. Objectively as well as the other 2 of the 2 x 2 matrix.
[4] I am mine. And then I let go of that. (I'll keep to within the bounds of this thread and our interaction on it).
We need scapegoats to the degree that our ideals contradict or are contradicted by the real - by nature.
Then we must find an excuse, or something to blame for our suffering, our failures, because we will never question our ideals.
So, spiritual nihilism must progress and evolve into secular nihilism, and secular nihilism must maintain its scapegoats, even if it overcomes the Messiah narratives.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 3:46 pm
We need scapegoats to the degree that our ideals contradict or are contradicted by the real - by nature.
Then we must find an excuse, or something to blame for our suffering, our failures, because we will never question our ideals.
So, spiritual nihilism must progress and evolve into secular nihilism, and secular nihilism must maintain its scapegoats, even if it overcomes the Messiah narratives.
The union of God and humans is what Messiah (Christ) does . There is no need for a scapegoat when the humanity of JC is emphasised. This is because the authentic adult person takes responsibility for his own actions and feels no need to blame God.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Fri Apr 18, 2025 12:42 pm
Didn't Nietzsche adequately diagnose the Christian disease?
Everything that followed is a footnote to his polemics.
Broaden his diagnosis to include all three Abrahamic variants of the same dis-ease.... then realize how it has evolved into secular variants, like Marxism and postmodernism
... a cure that is worse than the condition it is meant to treat. ...
For me that progressively, emergently became the cure, until it became a placebo. And the nausea returned.
I thought the most famous bit was about the madman who ran about the market place shouting God is Dead. This makes Nietzsche an existentialist not a nihilist.
Existentialist is the way to go for Christians who seek a reasonable religion.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 3:46 pm
We need scapegoats to the degree that our ideals contradict or are contradicted by the real - by nature.
Then we must find an excuse, or something to blame for our suffering, our failures, because we will never question our ideals.
So, spiritual nihilism must progress and evolve into secular nihilism, and secular nihilism must maintain its scapegoats, even if it overcomes the Messiah narratives.
My ideals can be summed up as equality of outcome for all, achieved by peaceful means. The first great milestone of that would be the liberation of all land. It cannot be owned by anyone. I blame us all for not achieving that. And therefore none. I blame evolution for making us 90% selfish monkey and 10% bee.
So...Equity.
Postmodernism.
Based on the presumption that all HUMAN, and only human, disparities are social in origin.
This only applies to humans...they are except from natural selection rules.
They are entirely the product of social selection.
So differences in athletic and academic performance are all social in origin.
Right.
I blame nobody.
I diagnose.
I expose the lies.
I, then, trace the roots of these lies, back to their origins....their causes.
Does a doctor blame a virus for the Patient's symptoms?
I guess he does...so in that sense I do.
But what a virus does, is what it is in its nature to do. I do not blame the virus for being what it is...so in that sense I do not blame.
What I despise, are lies and the liars that propagate them.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 4:44 pm
So...Equity.
Postmodernism.
Based on the presumption that all HUMAN, and only human, disparities are social in origin.
This only applies to humans...they are except from natural selection rules.
They are entirely the product of social selection.
So differences in athletic and academic performance are all social in origin.
Right.
I blame nobody.
I diagnose.
I expose the lies.
I, then, trace the roots of these lies, back to their origins....their causes.
What I despise, are lies and the liars that propagate them.
Regarding innate intelligence and athleticism, humans do evolve biologically as do other wild species. Human evolution is mostly cultural which is much much faster than is the biological process.
Other wild species, as far as is known, don't possess cultures that are capable of storing knowledge and ideas to anything like the same degree.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 3:46 pm
We need scapegoats to the degree that our ideals contradict or are contradicted by the real - by nature.
Then we must find an excuse, or something to blame for our suffering, our failures, because we will never question our ideals.
So, spiritual nihilism must progress and evolve into secular nihilism, and secular nihilism must maintain its scapegoats, even if it overcomes the Messiah narratives.
Given the immorality of the messianic concept, and how all our courts frown on knowingly punishing the innocent instead of the guilty, it should not be hard to have moral people reject what we have collectively already rejected.
The moral of the whole Bible is to recognize a good God from the putrid genocidal Trinity we adore.
I expected nothing different from your indoctrinated perspectives.
Man is entirely and completely a social animal.
6 000 years of relatively primitive social engineering usurps 70 000 years of natural selection.
Bravo dear.
You are an American, aren't you?
This is why the "race issue" will never be resolved. as long as this lie is not doubted, it cannot do more than seek something to blame....social racism....
Affirmative Action failed to equalize...so one it must be structural. Subconscious racism.
Crime statistics scream the truth....but these buffoons put their hands over their earns and sing....drowning out the noise.
Can we "heal speciation" by socially engineering uniformity?
If we raise a dog and a wolf in our stringent environment, under the proper supervision, proper training, will he nurture the wolf out of existence?
Watch what happens then policing is momentarily disrupted.
Watch them revert to their natural impulses.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Fri Apr 18, 2025 12:42 pm
Didn't Nietzsche adequately diagnose the Christian disease?
Everything that followed is a footnote to his polemics.
Broaden his diagnosis to include all three Abrahamic variants of the same dis-ease.... then realize how it has evolved into secular variants, like Marxism and postmodernism
Existentialist is the way to go for Christians who seek a reasonable religion.
* As brilliantly sung by Elton John in Levon, from the perfect album Madman across the Water. A double dose of Nietzsche, thanks Bernie!
Nothing about Christianity is reasonable. Existentialism doesn't make it so. Kierkegaard's leap of faith assumes axiomatic, unexaminable belief in God; it's nothing to do with believing in God, it's do do with believing God.
Last edited by Martin Peter Clarke on Sun Apr 20, 2025 5:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Pistolero wrote: ↑Sun Apr 20, 2025 4:44 pm
So...Equity.
Postmodernism.
Based on the presumption that all HUMAN, and only human, disparities are social in origin.
[Not my counter.]
This only applies to humans...they are except from natural selection rules.
[Who are you speaking for?]
They are entirely the product of social selection.
[See above.]
So differences in athletic and academic performance are all social in origin.
[See above.]
Right.
[Of course not.]
I blame nobody.
I diagnose.
I expose the lies.
I, then, trace the roots of these lies, back to their origins....their causes.
Does a doctor blame a virus for the Patient's symptoms?
I guess he does...so in that sense I do.
But what a virus does, is what it is in its nature to do. I do not blame the virus for being what it is...so in that sense I do not blame.
What I despise, are lies and the liars that propagate them.
