privilege = integration

[Advocate]

They both mean the same thing - regardless of where you are in it, society is working for you. It means you can progress forward with your desires and goals. It means you understand how things work and they don't interfere with your priorities too much. There are no examples of dis-integrated people who are also privileged or privileged people who are not also integrated. Even the outliers such as Jacque Fresco, John McAfee, Joe Quirk, or Aaron Schwartz, who exist(ed) on that margin, are good exemplars of the limits of each. If you lose your integration, you lose your privilege, and vice versa.

[Immanuel Can]

They both mean the same thing...

Heh.

No, no they don't.

For example, you can "integrate" somebody into the prison population. That's the opposite of him having any "privilege."

[Advocate]

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489612 time=1610557232 user_id=9431]
[quote=Advocate post_id=489610 time=1610557087 user_id=15238]
They both mean the same thing...
[/quote]
Heh. :D

No, no they don't.

For example, you can "integrate" somebody into the prison population. That's the opposite of him having any "privilege."
[/quote]

Integrated into sub-population x is not the same as integrated into society any more than "integrating" milk into a glass. I believe sometimes that you intentionally don't give a shit about logic or common sense. However, to the extent we can limit the conversation to a particular subset of what i was talking about, designed to be an exception by intent, yes, integration is also privilege in the context of prison. Those who are not integrated are in solitary or in the corner of their cell trying not to be raped up.

Changing the scale or context of an initial contention before you refute it is the purest form of straw-man fallacy.

[Immanuel Can]

They both mean the same thing...

Heh.

No, no they don't.

For example, you can "integrate" somebody into the prison population. That's the opposite of him having any "privilege."

Integrated into sub-population x is not the same as integrated into society

Yeah, it is. And not merely because all "societies" are sub-populations of something (which, of course, they are), but because to "integrate" means to put somebody into a population in which they are neither at a disadvantage nor at a privilege, and to "privilege" somebody is to put them above the population.

You need a dictionary.

[Advocate]

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489618 time=1610558785 user_id=9431]
[quote=Advocate post_id=489615 time=1610557885 user_id=15238]
[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489612 time=1610557232 user_id=9431]

Heh. :D

No, no they don't.

For example, you can "integrate" somebody into the prison population. That's the opposite of him having any "privilege."
[/quote]

Integrated into sub-population x is not the same as integrated into society
[/quote]
Yeah, it is. And not merely because all "societies" are sub-populations of something (which, of course, they are), but because to "integrate" means to put somebody [i]into [/i]a population in which they are neither at a disadvantage nor at a privilege, and to "privilege" somebody is to put them [i]above[/i] the population.

You need a dictionary.
[/quote]

You have too many dollars, you need a penny! The dictionary definitions don't clarify this point, which i have. As for you, stop changing the scale and pretending like you're still refuting the same thing, you're not.

Anyhow, it doesn't matter which scale you use, so long as you don't play the scale-switching game in mid sentence,, it's the same result. If you want to see how someone is privileged, see how they're integrated, and vice versa.

Integration is not neutral, it Always confers special benefits over those who are not. Being destitute Always means you're dis-integrated. It's the same concept used for two different contexts. There are no exceptions.

[Immanuel Can]

The dictionary definitions don't clarify this point...

priv·i·lege
/ˈpriv(ə)lij/
Learn to pronounce

noun
noun: privilege; plural noun: privileges
a special right, advantage, or immunity granted or available only to a particular person or group.
"education is a right, not a privilege"
Similar:
advantage
right
benefit
prerogative
entitlement
birthright


in·te·grate
/ˈin(t)əˌɡrāt/
Learn to pronounce

verb
verb: integrate; 3rd person present: integrates; past tense: integrated; past participle: integrated; gerund or present participle: integrating

Similar:
combine
amalgamate
merge
unite
join
fuse
blend...etc.
Opposite: separate

bring (people or groups with particular characteristics or needs) into equal participation in or membership of a social group or institution.

examples:
"integrating children with special needs into ordinary schools"
come into equal participation in or membership of society or an institution or body.
"she was anxious to integrate well into her husband's family"
desegregate (a school, neighborhood, etc.), especially racially.
"cities' efforts to integrate across urban-suburban lines"


It took me one click to find Oxford, and to prove you wrong about that.

[Sculptor]

They both mean the same thing -

It's not likely to be a promising thread when you write two different words and shove an equals sign between them.

[Advocate]

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489627 time=1610561111 user_id=9431]
[quote=Advocate post_id=489623 time=1610559733 user_id=15238]
The dictionary definitions don't clarify this point...[/quote]



[b]priv·i·lege[/b]
/ˈpriv(ə)lij/
Learn to pronounce

noun
noun: privilege; plural noun: privileges
a [color=#FF0000]special[/color] right, advantage, or immunity granted or available [color=#FF0000]only to a particular person or group[/color].
"education is a right, not a privilege"
Similar:
advantage
right
benefit
prerogative
entitlement
birthright


[b]in·te·grate[/b]
/ˈin(t)əˌɡrāt/
Learn to pronounce

verb
verb: integrate; 3rd person present: integrates; past tense: integrated; past participle: integrated; gerund or present participle: integrating

Similar:
combine
amalgamate
merge
unite
join
fuse
blend...etc.
Opposite: separate

bring (people or groups with particular characteristics or needs) into [color=#FF0000]equal [/color]participation in or membership of a social group or institution.

examples:
"integrating children with special needs into ordinary schools"
come into equal participation in or membership of society or an institution or body.
"she was anxious to integrate well into her husband's family"
desegregate (a school, neighborhood, etc.), especially racially.
"cities' efforts to integrate across urban-suburban lines"


It took me one click to find Oxford, and to prove you wrong about that.
[/quote]

Those definitions are perfectly compatible with what i said. To the extent one applies, the other applies. It's basic in-group/out-group.

[Immanuel Can]

Those definitions are perfectly compatible with what i said.

So you not only say stuff you've never thought about, but you can't actually read? Even the print in red is too hard for you to understand?

Oy vey.

[Advocate]

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489638 time=1610563227 user_id=9431]
[quote=Advocate post_id=489637 time=1610562972 user_id=15238]
Those definitions are perfectly compatible with what i said.
[/quote]
So you not only say stuff you've never thought about, but you can't actually read? Even the print in red is too hard for you to understand?

Oy vey.
[/quote]

The way you're trying to use that definition assumes equality in a way that is literally impossible. It means equal status, as in "you're accounted for in the system".

Want to test it, instead of hypothetical debunkings? Name a situation of privilege and i'll show you the corresponding integration, or vice versa.

[Immanuel Can]

The way you're trying to use that definition...

Not me. Oxford. And not "use." Just "repeat".

You said the dictionaries couldn't help you. They can. You don't want to be helped, though.

[Advocate]

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489645 time=1610563699 user_id=9431]
[quote=Advocate post_id=489643 time=1610563541 user_id=15238]
The way you're trying to use that definition...[/quote]
Not me. Oxford. And not "use." Just "repeat".

You said the dictionaries couldn't help you. They can. You don't want to be helped, though.
[/quote]

You're not a truth seeker.

[Immanuel Can]

You're not a truth seeker.

...said the guy who just said the dictionaries don't say what they say.

[Advocate]

[quote="Immanuel Can" post_id=489649 time=1610563910 user_id=9431]
[quote=Advocate post_id=489647 time=1610563791 user_id=15238]
You're not a truth seeker.
[/quote]
...said the guy who just said the dictionaries don't say what they say.
[/quote]

If all citizens, for example, had to be equal in any other sense than status, there would never be a way to integrate someone as a citizen. You're trying to make the words meaningless and in the same breath telling me i don't understand the words. Well, i do understand them. Your "evidence" is full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

Anyhow, i did say the dictionary definitions are insufficient, and the reason they're insufficient is that they don't recognize the correlation, just like you.

But back to the Proof Pudding, the fact that i can find either where the other exists means that either they're the same thing or aspects of some larger thing; either will do.

[DPMartin]

They both mean the same thing - regardless of where you are in it, society is working for you. It means you can progress forward with your desires and goals. It means you understand how things work and they don't interfere with your priorities too much. There are no examples of dis-integrated people who are also privileged or privileged people who are not also integrated. Even the outliers such as Jacque Fresco, John McAfee, Joe Quirk, or Aaron Schwartz, who exist(ed) on that margin, are good exemplars of the limits of each. If you lose your integration, you lose your privilege, and vice versa.

na, you're looking at a small segment of the population, if you are privileged then you have the properties of the privileged such as money, power, and or fame, otherwise you are not privileged. you need not be integrated into anything, but you need the properties to be treated as privileged and the privileged don't need desires and goals many are born into money and power.

this posting isn't a realistic view of privilege and integration