Designer Babies

[Terrapin Station]

I wonder if they could design a baby that could change it's own nappy (diaper), I can see there being a big demand for those.

Yeah, I'd like one of those. And a baby that doesn't cry, scream, etc. too.

[Terrapin Station]

I think Mary Shelley said it all.

I don't get it.

Sorry. I meant that 'Frankenstein' should be the only warning we should need, not to mess with life or play god. Even with in vitro, we are crossing lines we shouldn't, putting more pressure on population where it needn't have been. And with that and designer babies, what need will there ever be to adopt a child who already exists, and needs attention and nurturing?

I've always seen Frankenstein as a story that emphasizes problems with folks not accepting difference, not problems with being different. In other words, the problems arise due to the attitudes of the pitchfork-and-torch-carrying villagers, not Frankenstein's creature.

[artisticsolution]

How do you know? Have you done a study?

It would be interesting to know how many of these children who grew up on Ritalin faired well vs. those who became drug addicted adults.

If a drug has positive results, who the fuck really cares if you don't like the thought of children being "addicted" or adults for that matter.

''After they put him on Ritalin his grades went up and he was able to concentrate. A few years later...they decided to take him off it. His grades plummeted from A's and B's to D's and f's...he could not concentrate on the task at hand. So they put him back on it and he's getting A's and B's.''

They all say that; 'Oh, his 'grades' are so much better now'. And ever heard of 'drug withdrawal'? Let me guess. He was a 'day-care kid'?
Btw. Would you be ok with prescribing children with valium? If not, why not?

Btw, would you be okay with prescribing diabetic children , insulin?

No, he was not a 'day-care kid'. Listen, Veg...I get it...I really do. I have a tendency to think negative first, too. But if we want to do philosophy any justice, we must be diligent to fight those urges lest we get caught up in a narrow minded petty thought process.

You admitted you don't have all the facts. You are just passionate about your opinions. I too would love if we lived in a perfect world. However, we don't. Shit happens. Now, there may not be a cure for shit happening and so the best we can do is make due with what we have.

Personally, I want to see how these children on Ritalin fared as adults. Did they have adverse effects? Are they all homeless, drug addicts, suicidal, do they have poor health, etc. Or are they basically well adjusted adults capable of holding a job, interacting in society, etc.

If the majority have not been harmed...or arguably capable of pursuing a 'productive' lifestyle/career where one has the ability to be independent, then...no harm/no foul.

Again, not every child need Ritalin. My husband didn't, my sons didn't...I feel I did. I believe it would have helped my academic career immensely.

[artisticsolution]

I don't get it.

Sorry. I meant that 'Frankenstein' should be the only warning we should need, not to mess with life or play god. Even with in vitro, we are crossing lines we shouldn't, putting more pressure on population where it needn't have been. And with that and designer babies, what need will there ever be to adopt a child who already exists, and needs attention and nurturing?

I've always seen Frankenstein as a story that emphasizes problems with folks not accepting difference, not problems with being different. In other words, the problems arise due to the attitudes of the pitchfork-and-torch-carrying villagers, not Frankenstein's creature.

Hi Dalek, Don't we 'play God' every time we take an antibiotic? I thought you wanted to ease suffering? Designer babies might be the answer...or is non existence simply easier?

[vegetariantaxidermy]

Btw, would you be okay with prescribing diabetic children , insulin?

No, he was not a 'day-care kid'. Listen, Veg...I get it...I really do. I have a tendency to think negative first, too. But if we want to do philosophy any justice, we must be diligent to fight those urges lest we get caught up in a narrow minded petty thought process.

You admitted you don't have all the facts. You are just passionate about your opinions. I too would love if we lived in a perfect world. However, we don't. Shit happens. Now, there may not be a cure for shit happening and so the best we can do is make due with what we have.

Personally, I want to see how these children on Ritalin fared as adults. Did they have adverse effects? Are they all homeless, drug addicts, suicidal, do they have poor health, etc. Or are they basically well adjusted adults capable of holding a job, interacting in society, etc.

If the majority have not been harmed...or arguably capable of pursuing a 'productive' lifestyle/career where one has the ability to be independent, then...no harm/no foul.

Again, not every child need Ritalin. My husband didn't, my sons didn't...I feel I did. I believe it would have helped my academic career immensely.

You really aren't very bright are you? I have all the facts I need. Which 'facts' am I missing that would tell me children should be given addictive, mind-altering drugs when there is nothing wrong with them? Diabetes is a life-threatening DISEASE. 'ADHD' is NOT a disease. It isn't even claimed that it's a disease. It's pseudoscientific bullshit. Oh, this child gets bored easily. He must have a DISORDER. Let's just drug him up and FIX him, because he's making life inconvenient for his 'mom' and teachers. Ritalin is an addictive, mind-altering drug, like valium. Or heroin. Or 'crystal meth. NO child NEEDS Ritalin. Give it to the bloody teachers and mothers then, since they are the ones with the 'disorder'.

[artisticsolution]

Btw, would you be okay with prescribing diabetic children , insulin?

No, he was not a 'day-care kid'. Listen, Veg...I get it...I really do. I have a tendency to think negative first, too. But if we want to do philosophy any justice, we must be diligent to fight those urges lest we get caught up in a narrow minded petty thought process.

You admitted you don't have all the facts. You are just passionate about your opinions. I too would love if we lived in a perfect world. However, we don't. Shit happens. Now, there may not be a cure for shit happening and so the best we can do is make due with what we have.

Personally, I want to see how these children on Ritalin fared as adults. Did they have adverse effects? Are they all homeless, drug addicts, suicidal, do they have poor health, etc. Or are they basically well adjusted adults capable of holding a job, interacting in society, etc.

If the majority have not been harmed...or arguably capable of pursuing a 'productive' lifestyle/career where one has the ability to be independent, then...no harm/no foul.

Again, not every child need Ritalin. My husband didn't, my sons didn't...I feel I did. I believe it would have helped my academic career immensely.

You really aren't very bright are you? I have all the facts I need. Which 'facts' am I missing that would tell me children should be given addictive, mind-altering drugs when there is nothing wrong with them? Diabetes is a life-threatening DISEASE. 'ADHD' is NOT a disease. It isn't even claimed that it's a disease. It's pseudoscientific bullshit. Oh, this child gets bored easily. He must have a DISORDER. Let's just drug him up and FIX him, because he's making life inconvenient for his 'mom' and teachers. Ritalin is an addictive, mind-altering drug, like valium. Or heroin. Or 'crystal meth. NO child NEEDS Ritalin. Give it to the bloody teachers and mothers then, since they are the ones with the 'disorder'.

Now now...let's not get hysterical, lest someone have to give you a good healthy does of ritalin...lol.

Don't be melodramatic please...it doesn't help our philosophical discussion. Look, I am not saying hand drugs out to children if they don't need it, but if the benefit outweighs the harm, the common sense tells us it m8ght be a good option.

Not every child who is hyperactive has a probl3m learning. In my case I had a problem focusing but I was not hyperactive. I was a normal behaving child, who simple could not pay attention to the lesson. Not my fault...I really wanted to learn...I simply drifted off in my head....no one could tell this was happening...

There are all sorts of cases out there. Your close mindedness help no one.

You should have that checked out by a professional philosopher.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

Btw, would you be okay with prescribing diabetic children , insulin?

No, he was not a 'day-care kid'. Listen, Veg...I get it...I really do. I have a tendency to think negative first, too. But if we want to do philosophy any justice, we must be diligent to fight those urges lest we get caught up in a narrow minded petty thought process.

You admitted you don't have all the facts. You are just passionate about your opinions. I too would love if we lived in a perfect world. However, we don't. Shit happens. Now, there may not be a cure for shit happening and so the best we can do is make due with what we have.

Personally, I want to see how these children on Ritalin fared as adults. Did they have adverse effects? Are they all homeless, drug addicts, suicidal, do they have poor health, etc. Or are they basically well adjusted adults capable of holding a job, interacting in society, etc.

If the majority have not been harmed...or arguably capable of pursuing a 'productive' lifestyle/career where one has the ability to be independent, then...no harm/no foul.

Again, not every child need Ritalin. My husband didn't, my sons didn't...I feel I did. I believe it would have helped my academic career immensely.

You really aren't very bright are you? I have all the facts I need. Which 'facts' am I missing that would tell me children should be given addictive, mind-altering drugs when there is nothing wrong with them? Diabetes is a life-threatening DISEASE. 'ADHD' is NOT a disease. It isn't even claimed that it's a disease. It's pseudoscientific bullshit. Oh, this child gets bored easily. He must have a DISORDER. Let's just drug him up and FIX him, because he's making life inconvenient for his 'mom' and teachers. Ritalin is an addictive, mind-altering drug, like valium. Or heroin. Or 'crystal meth. NO child NEEDS Ritalin. Give it to the bloody teachers and mothers then, since they are the ones with the 'disorder'.

Now now...let's not get hysterical, lest someone have to give you a good healthy does of ritalin...lol.

Don't be melodramatic please...it doesn't help our philosophical discussion. Look, I am not saying hand drugs out to children if they don't need it, but if the benefit outweighs the harm, the common sense tells us it m8ght be a good option.

Not every child who is hyperactive has a probl3m learning. In my case I had a problem focusing but I was not hyperactive. I was a normal behaving child, who simple could not pay attention to the lesson. Not my fault...I really wanted to learn...I simply drifted off in my head....no one could tell this was happening...

There are all sorts of cases out there. Your close mindedness help no one.

You should have that checked out by a professional philosopher.

What 'philosophical discussion'? Are you retarded, or just trying to be patronising? I'm really not interested in your 'self-diagnosis'. Try some LSD. Doctors used to hand that out like lollies too. Or perhaps thalidomide if your 'disease' is pregnancy.

[Dalek Prime]

Sorry. I meant that 'Frankenstein' should be the only warning we should need, not to mess with life or play god. Even with in vitro, we are crossing lines we shouldn't, putting more pressure on population where it needn't have been. And with that and designer babies, what need will there ever be to adopt a child who already exists, and needs attention and nurturing?

I've always seen Frankenstein as a story that emphasizes problems with folks not accepting difference, not problems with being different. In other words, the problems arise due to the attitudes of the pitchfork-and-torch-carrying villagers, not Frankenstein's creature.

Hi Dalek, Don't we 'play God' every time we take an antibiotic? I thought you wanted to ease suffering? Designer babies might be the answer...or is non existence simply easier?

It's easier, and 100℅ suffering free, unlike anything else.

[Dalek Prime]

I don't get it.

Sorry. I meant that 'Frankenstein' should be the only warning we should need, not to mess with life or play god. Even with in vitro, we are crossing lines we shouldn't, putting more pressure on population where it needn't have been. And with that and designer babies, what need will there ever be to adopt a child who already exists, and needs attention and nurturing?

I've always seen Frankenstein as a story that emphasizes problems with folks not accepting difference, not problems with being different. In other words, the problems arise due to the attitudes of the pitchfork-and-torch-carrying villagers, not Frankenstein's creature.

Frankenstein is a story about creating a mind that 'can' suffer, and inevitably will. Why the creature suffers is secondary to the fact that he can and will suffer, needlessly.

[Dalek Prime]

You really aren't very bright are you? I have all the facts I need. Which 'facts' am I missing that would tell me children should be given addictive, mind-altering drugs when there is nothing wrong with them? Diabetes is a life-threatening DISEASE. 'ADHD' is NOT a disease. It isn't even claimed that it's a disease. It's pseudoscientific bullshit. Oh, this child gets bored easily. He must have a DISORDER. Let's just drug him up and FIX him, because he's making life inconvenient for his 'mom' and teachers. Ritalin is an addictive, mind-altering drug, like valium. Or heroin. Or 'crystal meth. NO child NEEDS Ritalin. Give it to the bloody teachers and mothers then, since they are the ones with the 'disorder'.

Now now...let's not get hysterical, lest someone have to give you a good healthy does of ritalin...lol.

Don't be melodramatic please...it doesn't help our philosophical discussion. Look, I am not saying hand drugs out to children if they don't need it, but if the benefit outweighs the harm, the common sense tells us it m8ght be a good option.

Not every child who is hyperactive has a probl3m learning. In my case I had a problem focusing but I was not hyperactive. I was a normal behaving child, who simple could not pay attention to the lesson. Not my fault...I really wanted to learn...I simply drifted off in my head....no one could tell this was happening...

There are all sorts of cases out there. Your close mindedness help no one.

You should have that checked out by a professional philosopher.

What 'philosophical discussion'? Are you retarded, or just trying to be patronising? I'm really not interested in your 'self-diagnosis'. Try some LSD. Doctors used to hand that out like lollies too. Or perhaps thalidomide if your 'disease' is pregnancy.

I take methylphenidate for ADD. If nothing else, it does seem to improve my speech, by allowing my thoughts to catch up with my mouth (or something like that). It has the opposite effect on me, in that its akin to a sedative effect on me, slowing me down.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

I take methylphenidate for ADD. If nothing else, it does seem to improve my speech, by allowing my thoughts to catch up with my mouth (or something like that). It has the opposite effect on me, in that its akin to a sedative effect on me, slowing me down.

Hmm. My thought's often don't connect all that well with my mouth. I also tend to think of a good response to an insult about a week later. Must be a disorder. Better go see my dealer (sorry, doctor). An adult brain is quite different from a developing child's brain. They also have no choice.

[Dalek Prime]

I take methylphenidate for ADD. If nothing else, it does seem to improve my speech, by allowing my thoughts to catch up with my mouth (or something like that). It has the opposite effect on me, in that its akin to a sedative effect on me, slowing me down.

Hmm. My thought's often don't connect all that well with my mouth. I also tend to think of a good response to an insult about a week later. Must be a disorder. Better go see my dealer (sorry, doctor).

All I'm saying is that I have experienced a net benefit. Would you prefer I not improve the quality of my life?

[vegetariantaxidermy]

I take methylphenidate for ADD. If nothing else, it does seem to improve my speech, by allowing my thoughts to catch up with my mouth (or something like that). It has the opposite effect on me, in that its akin to a sedative effect on me, slowing me down.

Hmm. My thought's often don't connect all that well with my mouth. I also tend to think of a good response to an insult about a week later. Must be a disorder. Better go see my dealer (sorry, doctor).

All I'm saying is that I have experienced a net benefit. Would you prefer I not improve the quality of my life?

Adults make those choices for themselves. Many say that smoking and alcohol improve their quality of life too. Doesn't mean they should be given to children. I don't see how anyone could justify the ritalin-for-children explosion. It's not even for the children, but the parents and teachers. AS even said the teachers were 'begging her to put him on ritalin' because they didn't have the skills to handle an active little boy.
In another few years we will be saying 'remember when doctors handed out ritalin like lollies to children?', just as we now say that about LSD, thalidomide, valium and the countless other 'harmless' drugs that have been promoted by drug companies over the decades.

[Dalek Prime]

Hmm. My thought's often don't connect all that well with my mouth. I also tend to think of a good response to an insult about a week later. Must be a disorder. Better go see my dealer (sorry, doctor).

All I'm saying is that I have experienced a net benefit. Would you prefer I not improve the quality of my life?

Adults make those choices for themselves. Many say that smoking and alcohol improve their quality of life too. Doesn't mean they should be given to children. I don't see how anyone could justify the ritalin-for-children explosion. It's not even for the children, but the parents and teachers. AS even said the teachers were 'begging her to put him on ritalin' because they didn't have the skills to handle an active little boy.
In another few years we will be saying 'remember when doctors handed out ritalin like lollies to children?', just as we now say that about LSD, thalidomide, valium and the countless other 'harmless' drugs that have been promoted by drug companies over the decades.

Fair enough. I was diagnosed just this year, in my fifties. I dont think it was a common diagnosis when I was a kid.

Just to mention, I don't drink or do illicit drugs. Im not what one would call an addictive personality., and if I wasn't being benefited in a mwasureable way, I would stop taking it. Most people would get a rush from it. Someone with ADD does not. Besides, 27mg, slow releasedbover 24 hours in not great deal. Addicts would have to chew them to get any effect. Addiction is all about intake speed, for the effect. Its the same as opiodvusage; if I'm in real pain, the opiod, used properly, will do nothing save ease pain to a more tolerable level. Now, if you start smoking it, or shooting, then there's a problem (intake for effect).

[vegetariantaxidermy]

Fair enough. I was diagnosed just this year, in my fifties. I dont think it was a common diagnosis when I was a kid.

Just to mention, I don't drink or do illicit drugs. Im not what one would call an addictive personality., and if I wasn't being benefited in a mwasureable way, I would stop taking it. Most people would get a rush from it. Someone with ADD does not.

When I think about it, all through my school years I can't think of a single child that I would describe as having a 'mental disorder', just many differing personalities that were accepted by parents and teachers alike. I suspect the navel-gazing and pill-popping revolution probably started in the US. Anything for a buck.